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March 10, 2006

Comments

Garrett

Anonymous:

BTW, feel free to contact me off-line:

pastor@saintandrewscc.net

Geoff

How about "Verily Reformed"? It adds that archaic flavor we liturgical types crave.

Garrett

Geoff,

Sounds like buckle shoes and canes. : )

Boneman

G,

My problem with being "post-Reformed" is that we have let pseudo-Calvinsits with Baptistic psychological moorings hijack our true identity and proud tradition. It is kind of like saying that we can't claim to be "catholic" because of Romanist distortions.

Look, a rose by any other name is still a rose, bro. You can call yourself a "boat" and you're still Reformed. It isn't how you identify yourself, it is how you are identified that matters - and you ARE Reformed.

My suggestion is that you claim to be exactly what you are - a Reformed Catholic. That says everything you want it to say and will be sure to distinguish you from the revivalistic nuttiness you want nothing to do with.

Garrett

Boney,

Are you trying to argue with me about not arguing with arguers?

Geoff

Bones,

I told Garrett offline that reclaiming the name is my preference.

"Boat" is not a bad idea for a name, but it has too much of a Scientology feel. I was thinking we could call ourselves "S'mores," because who doesn't like S'mores? But if you're saying that no matter what we call ourselves, we're still reformed I guess it's just no use.

Would you say that you are arguing for the "objectivity" of reformedom?

Garrett

My point is that you're not going to convince any plain-wrap TR that you're Reformed. They've hi-jacked the tradition. So instead of spending allot of time on useless arguing why not just move on. Post-Reformed means you are a Reformed Christian who wants to move the dialogue outside of Reformed circles and that you want to dialogue with the wider Christian culture for whom the label "Reformed" is meaningless.

I'm at that point where I really don't care about labels any more. I'm more interested in action. What you actually do will more accuractely define who you are. You want to be Reformed (and confessional), live it.

Garrett

Bones,

You wrote:

"My problem with being "post-Reformed" is that we have let pseudo-Calvinsits with Baptistic psychological moorings hijack our true identity and proud tradition."

My position is kinda like this. You live in this stinky run-down town that used to be the local metropolis (before the interstate got put in). Now its just a dying dust-bin. The folks who are left (the smart and interesting kids keep leaving for college and never come back) are primarily one note samba types regarding their (rather recent) traditions. They cannot bear dissent and are trying to force out the last few families that have broader perspectives.

You have been engaged in this heated process for over a decade and suddenly realize, "This town is totally irrelevant" and its dying. You've got no obligation to hang out here any longer. In fact, the ideals that once represented your society are being discussed in a more vigorous and thoughtful manner in the big city down the interstate. Why hang around giving yourself heartburn that maybe just maybe one day you can gain the status of "well he's sort of all alright but's he's still weird and I don't like him." Who cares what they say? I'm more interested in picking up my theological convictions and going somewhere where they can be put to use.

This is an example of the kinds of stupid, unloving, and totally unproductive things that the local hicks engage in when lost motorists happen into the old dump by accident. Haw-Haw:

http://kimriddlebarger.squarespace.com/the-latest-post/2006/3/4/pastors-cant-answer-questions-about-basic-doctrines.html

Boneman

Since we're doing parables - how about this?

There once was a vineyard that was very fruitful. Yea, verily, the bounty of that land was great.

And then one day some new workers came into the field to labor. In time, the fruit of that field became less bountiful and the workers began to fight among themselves about how to labor in it. Some laborers advocated leaving for another field because the soil was bad, and some said that there was only one way to cultivate the grapes and everyone must hold there trowels just so. The smallest group of laborers knew that the soil of that field was good and could thrive again regardless of how the trowels were held. They knew that the problem wasn't with the vineyard, but with the laborers themselves.

Soon one group left for another vineyard, leaving the small group of laborers with a large bunch of laborers who were now better at fighting than growing grapes. The small group said to the large group - let us work in this corner of the field to see how the harvest will be in our corner. The large fighting group begruddingly accepted their proposal. In time the harvest in that corner was much greater than the rest of the field. When the fighting group of laborers looked and saw that their harvest was not as good as the small corner - they asked why this was so. The small group responded, "They will know that you are my disciples if you love one another."

The fighting group tore their garments and repented of their fighting and trowel-holding nonsense - and now the whole field is the greatest in the land... again.

Your not post-reformed, G. You just labor in the corner instead of fighting in the middle.

Garrett

The field is the world.

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